Women teaching men how to be men for them.
Dilemma: Men, have you noticed how some women, when in relation with a men, want to change, and or modify the man into something they want for the man to be for them?
In addition, have you noticed how a some woman’s motherly instincts, takes the woman from supporting her son, to her male partner, in guiding the “boy becoming man” in being a man for her, other than for him self?
Have you seen control issues coming from the woman’s fear, in teaching the “boy becoming man” how to live in her fear and control?
Or maybe you have seen how the “boy becoming man” is not able to be a man for him self, and succumbs to the woman’s guidance before looking within to find out what he wants in life?
Situation: When the “boy becoming man” has not connected with his own power, he will let the woman, now maybe more like mother, control him into being something for her, that may not be his own choosing.
Question: Would this be an issue for the woman wanting something different for her man partner, or an issue for the “boy becoming man”, that let’s this happen to him in the relationship?
Conclusion: “Either way, how would one resolve this with partner?
12 comments
The only way this is resolved is within.
A man or woman will attract a controlling partner if they carry the wound of a victim. One which they most likely adopted through their domestication. When we lack our own self worth then we are easily manipulated and will bend and twist to fit the image the other approves.
The responsibility lies with the ‘victim’ not the perpetrator. The perpetrator’s actions offers a gift. Finding the courage to look within and accept that the answer lies in making the change here is the start. Through recognizing and owning the wound in the mind change can be brought about. The perpetrator will either leave to find another victim, not to respect or they will transform. Either way the dilemma will leave the persons life.
With love and respect jason.
Thank you Jason, for your comment on the latest posting. From my perspective, this is so true it is resolved with in each one, and communicating as a couple. Some times a controlling partner will attract a victim, or another reflecting their control issue, which can only mirror the victims behavior based on fear, in needing to be in control.
Yes, it’s the victim that may want to liberate them selves from their inability to say no, and as you say, and receive a huge gift, possibly freedom from their inability to set healthy boundaries, as they both communicate with kindness, compassion, truth, and love.
I do agree with Jason when he says that the victim in us can atract the predator in our relationships; as a mother, a girlfriend or a friend. If that is the case, healing the wound that created the victim-in-us will help us to understand the power as a man that has been given to us.
I have known about that “boy becoming man” who has not connected with his own power. But when does it happen?, when and why do we suddenly choose to become a puppet of the victim-in-us?. Sometimes it happens when a child grows up surrounded by an emotionally inestable live at home. In situations where the mother (in this case) would want something from his child; a partner that she never had with her husband. In this case, the projection of the victim-in-her, will transform the mother into a predator seeking for that idilic relation the she never had and her victim couldn´t chage. In my oppinion, this mother´s behaviour plus the always indulgent nature of the boy will favor that the relation mother-son ends in an special relation, more profound (not necessary sexual). But, what about the father?. He becomes the second in the familly relationship. The mother uses the son to manipulate and punish the father for those things that has never given to her, and the son suddenly becomes the “enemy” the “Dimmer rival” . The tension and the punishment to that boy from the father, in that insane relation, can make the son surrender and forget about his essence, who he is, and finish with the seeking of his power-as-a-man. He finally bacamen a VICTIM not knowing the word “NO”.
What next? He will have to recuperate all the energy that belongs by divine right by admiting that he is living from a victim place. He will have to start by saying sorry to his soul everyday, and cleaning the wounds that where created. He will have to forgive himself from the heart with no resentment, and thus, became a jaguar warrior. Always alert to those thing that may feed the Victim in him. With LOVE, SELFRESPECT, SWEETNESS and dialogue with the predators that he would meet in life, finally the victim will surrender to the new life lived from a place of POWER.
Thank you to you all.
Hello All-I feel the situation described by Luis for discussion is a situation that will be positively solved only if BOTH parties can attempt to communicate honestly with each other. I know this step can be quite fearful, but I also know that the more one attempts to talk about the issues, the easier and less frightening it becomes-”Hey, I did this before and survived!!”
The past is the past, and is beyond our control. The way we react to current situations and future situations is the only thing we have any modicum of control over. So, I will keep trying to make the situation better, and hopefully, with practice, get it on track to a good outcome.
I have one more personal gripe, and that is the use of terms like Victim and Perpetrator. To me, these put an unnecessasarily harsh tone and label on someone with whom we hope to end up having a loving relationship.
As the Sages say”Your words are like fire!”
Best to all.
Raphiel
yes many women after in a marriage or relationship want to “fine tune” the man for their wants/needs and often time if he allows them to control and fine tune him, the woman will not like him.. that want to change him but another part of them realizes that if he allows them to do this they do not then like him.. a paradox.. you can write all this heavy stuff about the victim wounds and stuff … but basically he must NOT ALLOW THIS… he must become aware … and pay attention because they move subtly and many men can be changed fine tuned and they are not even aware of what has been done to them, their power is taken away… they can become angry and not know why.. … pay attention men… rafa
the man must become aware of his masculine strength .. he must become aware of a woman’s instinctive tendency to dominate him… he must not become passive in his relationship to his woman, he must express his anger , his related anger and not be overcome by it, he must be able to deal with her dark side, he must overcome his fear of her anger… he must not ignore matters of relationship because to her it is the same as ignoring her.. and he must understand that many times women will welcome a man’s anger because it tells them they have gone too far…
rafa
As the Sages say ”Your words are like fire!”…..And Fire will burn through the veils of illusion
The use of terms like Victim and Perpetrator/Judge are not name calling but describe the view point from which the person is coming from in their mind without awareness. They are acting from and reacting to unconscious beliefs rooted in fear. The way out of this is to recognise that within oneself own them, give them expression from a place of awareness and love.
Where two come together owning each of their side of the equation and in the best way they can communicate honestly this is beautiful and shows great courage and awareness. But it is rare.
The best place to start is owning your own side because its where your responsibility ends.
Raphiel what do these words push in you? would you say your response comes from fear and a need to defend or from Love and respect for oneself and beloved?
Much Love and respect to you.
jason
jason i am just saying for the average ordinary guy.. like me.. some of the comments seem far too complicated to understand.. that is all.. those words do not push much of anything in me.. certainly not name calling .. just lot of big words that are difficult for an average kind of guy like to relate to without having a brain lockup trying to figure out what in the hell is he trying to say.. i would say the common guy coming out of sports authority would have no fucking idea what all those words would mean.. no need for me to defend .. i am just trying my best to say in simple words what i feel is important to men ….
rafa
Hi!,
This is a quite a torturos item that may push a lot of men wanting to get rid of limiting patterns. In any moment in our lives that we have forgotten or denied ourselves in order to please someone, men or women. How to talk about it, is a mere process. What in my opinion is difficult is to face the emotional feelings, such as resentment, anger, and hate, that one creates when giving life to such behaviour.
What I found when having to express what I felt about any limitted pattern in me was not words at all, and when hearing any advice from Don Luis, I did not understand some of the conceps he was telling me about how the limitted patterns use to trap my first, and now my second attention, and how my mind would do ANYTHING not to understand or even listen. The funny thing is that those same words, in other concepts had a clear and direct sence. I could understand everything!!!. My feelings got in the way of my own understanding.
So my advice as a warrior (a man alert to its emotions) is to keep stalking one’s self, just as the Jaguar does his hunt. Alert your attention to those things you may “not want to hear, neither to understand.” Find a place were you can be calm. Stop, go inside, center your attention to that fact, and let the emotions come through. Then just let your self listen to your feelings and emotions. This may take time in connecting within you, and at the same time, if I could do this, you can also do the same.
Thank you all for letting me express this process that has helped me connect with my emotional body.
With love, José
Dear everyone-Jason, thanks for your comments. First of all I should say that I am an absolute expert in fear denial( Don Luis can attest to this ) Secondly, the words Victim and Perpetrator continue to seem like stumpling blocks on the path to reconciliation. Spouse, Husband, partner, significant other , critic would , I think, work better in coming to a good outcome. Having said that, I can see somewhere in the conversation saying “Your behavior makes me feel like a victim, but what i want to feel is loved and respected”. Admittedly good and positive talk is unusual, one only need to look at the divorce rate here in the US. At any rate, I’m finding these discussions enjoyable and thought provoking.
I must agree with jason that we accept responsibility for our actions and thoughts as what else do we have a possibility of controlling, and even our own stuff gets way out of control given the slightest chance.
Best to all.
.
Raphiel
part and parcel of this is that often the woman/ wife will subtly destroy her man’s friendship with his male friends. friends of his that perhaps she feels in some way are a threat to their marriage or she simply does not like or want in his life. i have had some beautiful friendship destroyed in that way. and pay attention men, they can do it so undercover, you will not know what happened .. my personal wisdom shouts .. protect your bond with other important men in your life rafa.. if the partner/ wife does not want them in your home or social life, then take time to see them on your terms .. perhaps outside of your home.. but protect and nurture them nevertheless …..our culture does not support us men on this front.. pay attention.. rafa
Hi,
It is important that we assume our role in this limited pattern that make us, as the men that we are, to give our power to those people that, conscious or unconsciously, try to call our attention to their will. It is not, in my oppinion, a matter of if it is a woman who in her “intrinsic motherly” traps our first and second attention. Even if she does it consciously, the anger the fear, the hate we may show against them (men/women/wrong actions that goes against us..) is completly focus against our own behaviour. In my oppinion, as we all know, we are the only being who can punish ourself with an accurate impeccablility. From that punishment, the victim will focus the guilt outside us.
If we as men (or women) feel the power of someone trying to pull us towards something that we may seem “against us”, we as warrior MUST act against that, from a loving place in which we feel that we are able to express the others (thus act) that such behaviour would be agains our nature or our purpose.
With love, José
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